Wed, 01/22/2003 - 23:41
Hi folks !
About a year ago or so I was using OpenCascade for a project but I gave up on it at the time, I have thought about giving it another try but before I do that I would like to get some input on the old problems.
Three things that comes to mind are:
the project files (.dsp) was junk, they had to me modified to actually work every time I downloaded them from CVS, I don't think any one ever tested them, is this better today ?
Another thing was the boolean operations they only worked in some cases, it had some thing to do with the type of shapes, for example a cut between a box and a sphere only worked if the sphere was rotated a little, I got a promise that this would be fixed "soon" and that was close to two years ago so I would expect this to be fixed by now... any one knows ?
And finally, the attitude from Matra, yes you can download Open cascade for free, yes you can distribute your applications for free, ohhh you want help from us ??? well that will cost you lots of money, someting like "if we havn't put it in the docs we sure as hell arn't gonna tell you". the only reason I did manage was that there was a number of very helpful people on this forum that did help me out when I hit the wall.
I asked one time about a thing that was missing from the docs, I didn't get an answer beacuse no one know the answer, it wasn't in the docs so it would be difficult for a person outside Matra to answer it without heavy digging in the source code, so I asked if some one from Matra could help me out, there should be some one on this forum, the answer was to buy support, their job was not to sit here and answer stupid questions, fair enough but in that case they should give a very clear indication that they do not give any support at all and maybe put the forum in another place, as it is know this looks like a forum supported by Matra and I think lots of people expect to be able to get some kind of support here, but maybe it's just me complaining a lot, so if I am wrong or things have changed to the better I would be happy to know.
So I thought the best way to get a straigt answer would be ask people that actually use OpenCascade...
I hope it don't sound like I hate Opencascade in any way, I don't, I think it's a very impressive package.
regards,
Mikael
Thu, 01/23/2003 - 02:03
Hi Mikael,
nice to see you again !!
About your questions : a quick answer : it is worse !
1/ the dsp : I think it is like before. But, I have done a programm ( not yet released ) to generate automatically the dsps. You just need to call a .bat, and all is recompiled.
2/ boolean operations : I don'y know, I didn't test the new boolean operations ( the algorithms have been reworked ). But with a test, it worked before, but with the new algos it doesn't.
( see http://www.opencascade.org/forumorg/bug.php?bug_id=99&f=8 )
3/ the support is non-existant in the forum. I triy my best, but it is a big job.
BTW, about the support, it also worse, because, at the beginning, the bugs entered in the Bugs sections from www.opencascade.org were handled but the Matra-team. Today, not anymore.
I entered some very big bugs, but never get an answer.
BTW, the CVS is not updated. The last update was several months ago ( 29/07/02 )
from this thread ( http://www.opencascade.com/community/forum/thread_2863/ ), Arnaud Magnier from OpencASCADE announced a new version for autumn 2002 (no comment...)
For information : no response for this thread ( http://www.opencascade.com/community/forum/thread_3919/ ), this one ( http://www.opencascade.com/community/forum/thread_3647/ ), and this ( http://www.opencascade.com/community/forum/thread_3928/ )
For the docs, the only doc available are the cdls and cxx files.
And you said " I hope it don't sound like I hate Opencascade in any way, I don't, I think it's a very impressive package. ".
So do I.
HTH,
Stephane Routelous
http://www.exotk.org
Thu, 01/23/2003 - 02:55
Hi !
Thanks for the input, and thanks for all the help in the past.
If no one is updating the CVS and no one fixing the bugs, then it's a pretty bad sign, the question is, is the OCC version Matra is selling on the CD the same or do they fix bugs in there that does not get into the CVS, or do they continue to sell occ with all those bugs in there ?
Anyway, when no one is fixing bugs and no one is updating the CVS, and even worse no one is responding to the questions about this, I can only see that as a bad sign, even though I hope that I am wrong.
It would be nice if someone could give some more information about this, what I am a bit interested to find out is:
Are "we", the users expected to fix bugs and carry on the development of OCC ?
If so, do you intend to use the things we fix and put into the OCC that you sell ? if so what do we get in exchange for that ?
As I said above is the CVS version of OCC the same as you sell ? or are they different ?, if so don't any customers complain about bugs, a few of them look's pretty critical ?
Is anyone at Matra working on bug fixes ? if so it would be interesting with some information about what's going on.
A estimation of when we can expect an update of the CVS or a new version (even with just the worst bugs fixed) is at least what could be expected I belive.
In the past at least a few of the folks at Matra was lurking on this forum, is any one of you still here or are you busy selling support ?
Mikael
Thu, 01/23/2003 - 10:04
Hi,
I hope they've just freezed CVS 40 (as Stephane said 50 was announced for autumn 2002) - it was the same from 3.1 to 40.
But I also think the docs have to be more. I was thinking of doing doxygen configs for the different packages but have no time at the moment.
We can contribute code but not in CVS directly.
I don't have tested the new BOP (Boolean Operation Project) - I wait for V5 because I have no interest searching for bugs which could be fixed in a stable release.
Patrik
Thu, 01/23/2003 - 16:08
Hi !
That might be the reason, but in that case we should at least recieve som kind of information about this, no one is even answering the questions asked about it, and that is the problem, if thay have freezed the cvs then that's fine, but the problem is no one knows if this is the case..... and that is the actual problem....
Mikael
Thu, 01/23/2003 - 10:16
I agree to all of you. Lets wait and see, what will happen to OpenCASCADE when EADS Matra Datavision will become part of IBM. Additionally I wait for the release of SALOME, but nothing happend.
Best regards,
Michael
PS: Hi Stephane! Nice to hear something from you again !Still in Canada?
Fri, 01/24/2003 - 17:10
For your information, IBM only
bought Matra Datavision, not Opencascade.
From a formal point OpenCascade is no more a
part of MDTVision.
IBM was not interested in buying opencascade.
Fri, 01/24/2003 - 17:35
Hi !
But Matra was doing all the OCC development before (with some help of other developers to), so that would mean that OpenCascade is no longer being developed by them ? is that correct ?
Mikael
Fri, 01/24/2003 - 17:41
OpenCASCADE is developped by OpenCASCADE company.
Fri, 01/24/2003 - 17:46
Hi !
Ok, that explains it, so OpenCascade does not have anything to do with Matra any longer then, anyway it would still be nice with some information about what's going on with the CVS and bug fixes...
Mikael
Fri, 01/24/2003 - 18:04
Hi,
I second that.
For me, the main problems are not the ones decribed in a previous message.
The problem is that we don't have any information on what's happening.
If there are some (good) reasons why there is no more CVS update, no more bug corrections, etc..., so the OpenCASCADE Cie has to publish them.
For me, as an OpenSource developper, it is not a big problem. But what about a Cie investigating using OpenCASCADE for a big project ? Do you think the lack of transparency gives a good image of the product/of the company ?
I think what's currently happens in the opencascade.org web site/forum is a VERY BAD advertising for OpenCASCADE.
So, if the OpenCASCADE Cie don't want to die, they should change the way to handle the problems.
my 2 (euro-)cents.
Sat, 01/25/2003 - 18:32
The version 5.0 of OCC will be release probably in february or in march.
The team (in russia) are still working on the boolean operation package.
Sat, 01/25/2003 - 21:07
Hi !
Ahhh, suddenly there does pop up some information, many thanks for that.
Mikael